Lightning

[WebMaster]

On our way back from NYC, we got into some weather, and in the course of that, observed 4 really strong lightning strikes nearby. It sure got my attention!! I assured my wife that they wouldn't affect us (what else was I going to say!!). What would happen if we were to get hit. I understand that with static wicks, which we have, it is unlikely, but what if?
Thanks

[Guy Paris]

Larry,

Over the course of 30 years of flying Heavy Iron I had (3) strikes of one sort or another and I remember them all. (1) was lightning for sure. It had the classic zig zag look, we were decending into Boston, when I saw it I crossed my arms in front of my eyes and when I peaked it zapped the airplane a B727. I remember What our concerns were, that it didn't do damage to the eletrical systems. which it didn't. We were told we had flame arresters in the fuel tanks. On the walk around some of the discharge wicks were missing some were loose and it looked like someone struck across the fuselage with an arc welder. I still have one of the wicks some place. One was on approach into Cleveland, it was snowing, we had a lot of gas in the event we had to divert. On short final a new F/E asked if he should shut off the wing anti-ice, I said ok. Just then the aircraft got zapped just when I should have been pulling off some power that the wing bleed air was using, it went right to additional thrust when I did not want it. Got her back on speed and landed. On the remainder of that rotation I think it was either a (3) or (4) day trip one of my eyes ached. when I went to the eye doc he said I had a slight burn in the retna. The last was some sort of strike/discharge leaving Detroit, again light snow/drizzle conditions. The last (2) there were no returns as I recall on the radar. Keep a good distance from them. Some one will have a good handle on the subject I would guess, RE: pos. charge, neg. charge, cloud to cloud, cloud to ground types of lightning....Guy....old72driver....

[WebMaster]

It is interesting, we had cleared all the detectable (radar) storms and the scope was clear when we started seeing lightning.
We have radar, but no storm scope.

[SkyKing]

Hey Larry,

Keep away from those 'electrical' bolts!!!

I recall reviewing a 1978 P-model - equipped with radar - it was involved in a direct strike and the rear engine had to be removed and replaced... so be careful. Static wicks won't save you from lightening rods!

SkyKing

[kevin]

I have read that when a thunderstorm is in the developing stages, there is lightning but no rain. Heavy rain is during the mature stage of the thunderstorm, and continues while the storm is dissipating. So just because no rain does not mean no thunderstorm. You can get in some mean turbulence and lightning with no significant radar returns.

As a mechanic in the Air Force, I have repaired a number of airplanes that have been struck by lightning. It is quite damaging to the aircraft, and the crew seats have to be replaced, but I guess it very seldom brings down the airplane, even aluminum GA airplanes. On the other hand, I am sure you remember the picture I had up on the site of what a single lightning strike did to an unprotected composite airplane parked on the ground...

FWIW, I'm no expert.

Kevin

[Keven]

Larry:

I've been shopping on-board weather avoidance for awhile now. If you want to see real time video of an aircraft strike, go to http://www.insightavionics.com/ and click on aircraft being hit by lightning. Pretty scary stuff.

Ironically, on my way to OSH, I was dodging the stuff MUCH closer than I ever desired to. Hope none of us ever see it or experience it first hand!!!

Keven
________
N02 vaporizer (http://no2vaporizers.com)

[GMAs]

something even worse than lightening... HAIL...

War story.... We were coming back from a big storm out in the alantic... and we got a call from the Center asking if we would meet ATC over on a nother frequency... which we did.. as they mentioned that it was a small plane.. a cessna 337... that was having some problems...

We dialed up ATC and they gave us radar vectors to where the GA plane was ... our radar was painting a lot of returns.. with heavy ISO Echos... the wx officer was advising me which way to go.. along with the NAv... it got real bumpy and we started to see the Squal line ahead... but, what was more interesting was that the small GA plane had penatrated it and we kept getting lost returns along with ATC.. the only thing that they got constant was the Transponder sig... anyway.. we finally got up to where he was.. and was he in trouble.. Heavy cells all around almost like he was in the eye of a hurk... but, we stayed on the outside... talking to him was not very good as the static crashes were deathing on the ears.. and finally the WX and nav said the only way your going to get this guy out is to go in and give him a way out... as he couldn't climb over... I really didn't want to get into the storm as their was no reason for two of us to go down... as some of the up and down drafts were pretty wicked... about 1500 ft/min... but, what was worse we hit thermal areas that the wx officer said.. get ready for ICE... great I thought... this guy stumbled into this thing .. without a clue.. what he was getting into.. and should have stayed home... but, his wife was on the radio... actually could hear her better than him because of the higher voice... and she kept asking ... can you help us...

Ok... I finally gave in and call the center and said we were going to assist the small plane... did a fuel check and then let the crew know we were going to penatrate the wall... which we did... immediately we got lightening.. strikes all around.. and the area around the windows had a blue glow to them... and when you ran your hand down the metal parts you got sort of a buzz kinda static electricity... but, the herc was made to go into storms and pick up static.. the skymaster wasn't... now what we do is something a little different than what is taught in schools... I put my sunglasses on... yep the military sunglasses will keep ou from getting blinded by the lightening.. then next thing we do is brighten up all the lights that way after the flash.. you can still see.. something about the eye and its retna.. so I was led to believe... then we got hit... and you know you are because the flash is right with the sonic boom... kinda thing.. a quick check of the inst and engines and we keep going... now the co-pilot sits over their and keeps his eyes closed.. and not because he is saying his prayers.. but, because if I get blinded by the bolt.. he can open his and take over... most of the time he would keep his ball cap down so that only the inst pannel was visible and not the window area... you have to train for this stuff... its not something that you will find in a good book.. kinda thing...

So we finally got slowed down and came around the cessna... he was all over the sky... we gave him a heading to go to and told him to climb as high as he could... as the higher you go the less crud you will run into... the wx officer said ... hail at 3.. and we had him turn as the hail was falling from above.. it would be like rocks hitting paper... but, then we hit the rain... now rain is good.. but, rain that is about 34 deg and droping is not.. I got to look at the plane and I asked if they had iceing equip... when I got a what is that... I said swell... I told the pilot to climb as much as he could... as we went by him... we were at 140 kts.. he was at 120... so we kept haveing to make big circles... to stay with him... then lighting struck again... this time it appeared to be between us... but, the guy turned away.. back towards the downcoming hail... I called and told him to go back to the orginal course... and stay on it.. he said his dg was not working too well... I made the comment anything else that we should know... to myself... and told him to set it and follow it ... if it goes off I will advise him to reset... lucky later we found out it was really OK... but, he was trying to reset the compass heading... not something you want to do in a bad storm... as it will bounce around as well as swing towards the lightening strike...
See part II

[GMAs]

Well we hit ice... but, we made it past the new build up... which was putting out the lightening and hail... and now we had another problem for him to work out... he said he had about 2 inches of ice.. and couldn't see out the front window... So I though... stay on instruments... and listen to us... but, this guy wasn't instrument rated.. according to his wife who was handling the radios... great this guy is out flying in the soup and probably didn't check the weather before he left... and got stuck.. and now we find out he is not instrument rated... geezzzzz...

I told him to stay on course and if the plane could not maintain altitude.. to let it start down.. but, to maintain his airspeed... which luckly he did... we in the mean time had our problems with heavy iceing as the 130 was not liking flying at the spead I was..doing.. it wouldn't shake the ice.. so we offset the two outboard engines... ya we had 4... and let the vibration of the out of sync shake the ice along with the heat and boots... again it was a little trick we learned from experance... of course the crew downstairs are going nuts but, you do what you have to... kinda thing and they knew it... so they just stuffed more cotton in the headsets and beared it...

The good news started when the Wx officer said... 6 miles.. clear air... a quick check of the alt and we guestimated that he could make it.. if he didn't lose too much... I called Center and got a IP for the O2's on line... and asked if he had any advise ... command had already called him up and he was listening to the calls... and said .. we were doing it right... and that if things got worse he would call SnR for him next...

It was a long 6 miles and 3 min time... for the guy but, they broke out on the backside of the dry line... at about 4000 ft... then the front engine quit... but, the back one was still turning and burning... man this guy was out for a thrill of a lifetime.. was my thoughts... the co-pilot commented .. bet he gets down and never goes flying again... I just smiled and said ya on the intercom...

But, not all was through yet... his radio kept getting weaker and weaker... and was hard to hear... we called center again and they said that they could not raise him... so we cranked it up and we could just barely hear his wife talking when we were within 1/2 mile of him... when we got a visual .. he looked like a white ice cube... and the antennas for the radio.. were gone on top... at least that is what the observes said as we went by... and yep the fwd engine was feathered and iced up... according to them...

I called center and said we needed a field for him to land at right now... they said to hold on a min and came back with a small field about 5 miles due ahead... great at least something was going right for this guy... so we thought... but, nope... things got worse again... now we got rain.. heavy rain.. and when we came by again... the obs could not see inside the cabin... saying it looked like it was frozen over... darn... this guy is not a instrument pilot... and now we have one shot at getting him down on a runway... but, the rain was a blessing because when we made our next pass... I told him to drop the gear.. and when he did.. those great big doors... shucked ice off and opened up... droping the wheels... some of the ice hit one of my props but, nothing big...

I explaned that the runway was due ahead... and that he was going to have to land... we would set him up on course... and stay off to one side... while he came down the slope... he replied that he could open the vent window and see out of it.. but, the windsheld was frozen over... and the defrost was not working anymore because the fwd engine was out... too late I though... this guy is heavy with ice and now is the time... he kept his airspeed up ... as we told him to... and I planed a sweep around about the time he was going to be touching down... he was dead on the runway... and as his wife said it was real scary to think they could not see ahead... but, they could to the side thru the little vent window..hole... he got to withing 20 feet of the ground and all by his self he made a good landing... with only a little help from us to keep him streight on the runway...

Later we got a call from the CAP who was on their way over to the field... and they said they couldn't believe the Ice that they plane had on it.. some 30 min after it landed.. big chunks were falling off... on the ground.. it was clear ice... from the frozen rain we had gone through... and they said that when they opened up the fwd cowl...the engine was one solid piece of ice...inside...

You still want to fly in the thunderstorms.. and bad wx with your little radar... you are brave...

As to lightening hitting aircraft.. ya it makes a little burn mark.. and will blow the static discarges right off the plane if not the heavy duity types.. and you will lose your radios and any other electronic device that is not grounded well... anything with a antenna is history... unless its commercial military grade... so we have seen... but, most of the time you will get residual induction from the bolt... and contending with static discharge is about all ... if one does hit the plane... my advise is to land... now... as the wx is going to get much worse... and lightening is not your biggest nightmare... Ice and hail is... in all my years of flying I never heard of many small planes getting direct strikes except for being on the ground... then again I have heard of golfers getting zapped more times than planes getting hit... smile... maybe it has something to do with the fibbing on the scores... Hmmmmm...

Ok end of war story... seriously.. check the wx and if their is any chance for thunderstorms CB's Q's or sever wx like freezing rain... stay out of their.. your plane is strong but, not that strong.. and I don't care if your flying a 130 C5 or 737... iceing and hail is the worst thing that you can get into... not lightening... its the second worst thing... and the third is the viloent drafts and wind sheers... all of which will runin you day... if you get into them...

Its not much to play in the fuffly little white clouds... that look like cotton balls.. but, when they start to group up and the heat of the day comes... time to land.. because they go from fun to some serious life threating flying... real quick... best to land and watch it from the ground and have the bird in the hangar.. so the hail doesn't turn it into wrinkle finsih... smile..

Only advise I can give ya... smile.. hope somewhere in their is a lesson to be take seriously.... G.M> GMAs

[WebMaster]

Thanks,
The weather we were in, the rain and stuff, was light, and we used the radar to keep pointed away from the heavy stuff. Mostly it was fluffy clouds which Kathryn does not like. But, when we were clear of all that, and saw lightning, it scared her like crazy.
We learn. Sometimes it cost us a lot to learn. ATC was reporting storms south of us, and nothing in our area. Would a storm scope have helped? Maybe, but if these were the first strikes, it wouldn't have warned you that they were developing.
The best lesson, is stay away from it. Oh, and stay current on the instrument stuff!!!

[Bob Cook]

Larry

1) stormscopes are essential. In fact more important than Radar IMHO.

2) had the engine cowls cleaned of fiberglass and paint in a nice looking , not so high, puffy white cumulus. Cowls had to be replaced in a cessna 402B.

3) Had atc put me in the middle of a growing cb that did not show on their radar (over orlando) two years ago. Lightening below. 2k ft / min rate of climb and little rain. Just a nice young jobby that showed up on my stormscope and did not show a thing on their radar. They diverted everything behind me after they say the encoder go squirly <G>.

I have found the strikefinder the ONLY trustworthy device to find these young ambitious obnoxious cells.....

If no radar turn on the ADF and listen for the intensity of the static and see how the needle deflects. Good indication you are getting close to trouble. (for those without stormscopes.

Bob

[kevin]

Bob reminds me of when I flew into some pretty white cumulous clouds (before I had my Stormscope) at 18,000'. Tops looked to be about 25K. I asked the controller twice to make sure she did not vector me into something that showed on her radar (this was on approach to Raleigh-Durham, so it was approach radar, not center radar). She whined (literally) "you even want me to vector you around the level 2 returns?". I said yes ma'am, and she turned me 30 degrees. In the middle of downwind for an ILS approach they turned the airport around, and so I had to fly back in the other direction on another downwind. When I broke out of that overcast at 1500' it was the blackest, ugliest sky I never want to see me in again. I landed, turned off the runway, taxied to the ramp, and by the time I was walking into the office it was raining hard. They had my rental car right there ready for me, so in about another minute I was on my way out of the airport. Before I got off the airport it was raining so hard that I had to stop the car until it passed (as did everyone else on the road). Thunder, lightning, hail, the whole shot. Rained about as hard as I saw in Thailand during a monsoon. Probably 20 - 25 minutes from the time I entered that pretty, white, 25,000' cloud.

I couldn't afford it, but we put the stormscope in about 2 months later. It is my wife's favorite instrument in the whole airplane, and she thinks it is the best use of money we have ever made in regard to the airplane.

Kevin

[SkyKing]

Kevin,

So tell us... which model stormscope did you install?

SkyKing

[kevin]

A WX-950 that I got used from Valentine Aviation. Bob Cook or Skyking (can't remember which) pointed out the listing on ebay. It cost 2,000 - 3,000, can't recall exactly, plus installation of course. Works very well. Was very useful getting in and out of Denver last week.

Kevin

[Kevin McDole]

Larry,

Have you had an opportunity to take a radar course? Be very careful about assuming you are using it and interpreting the results correctly. Simply put, if you do not aim it correctly, you will not see the storms - and be led to believe you're in the clear, when in fact you may be in imminent danger.

Consider this simple scenario (which perhaps you were experiencing): if you beneath a T-Storm in the clear, you will not see it on your radar (since it is directly above you).

While I own a radar equipped aircraft (RDR-160), I am a novice in this subject - but I caution you understand the shortcomings & limitations of your radar before you bet your life that it'll guide you through the weather.

Dave Gwinn is one of the experts in this area – check him out at:
http://www.davegwinn.com/

[Jerry De Santis]

As most of you already know, radar,as nice as it is, only shows rain and not electrical activity. ATC uses radar and to them any rain echo may or may not have electrical activity associated with it. When you ask ATC if any weather is in front of you, if it does not cantain rain they don't know. That is why it is importanty to have a stormscope. I have a 1000+ and it is a good unit. Look out 200 mile or zoom in to under 5 miles.
Jerry:D

[Bob Cook]

I have had fair amount of experience with the RDR150. It is not very effective as a radar. You need vertical stabalization and a good size reflector before it becomes an effective tool. You really do need to know how to interpret a b/w radar. You can get suckered!

On Friday I came thru one front and a "mess" of wx between Tallahasse and Savanah. Nexrad showed level 4 TCU. Stormscope showed clear. Hmmm. ATC showed NOTHING!. They were pushing 30k ft.

Later on.... over PIT. Level 4 on Nexrad. Strikefinder - good action (+30 hits/min). ATC- level 2-3. I went around them at 15kft.

Believe ATC, forget it. #1 visual avoidance, #2 stormscope, #3 nexrad, #4 radar. ( in order of importance).

CB's can build quickly in afternoon heating too fast for nexrad or ATC to catch. MHO.

I prefer to dodge them visually <G> in smooth air.

Bob