Garmin Discussions at KOSH

hayesjaj · #1 07-28-21, 10:12 PM

While attending Airventure today we spoke with a number of Garmin engineers, one of which who is in charge of the autopilot decisions, the GI-275 lead, and one who works in testing/compliance. The outcome was:

Monday, Garmin extended the GI-275 EIS system to cover 337s. The only two requirements he quoted were 1) they need to be located in the panel one above another and 2) the prop sync display has been removed. I asked regarding penny cap systems and they are not supported so one would need to use CIES senders (they recommended them) if you have a pennycap system (73 and on).

Regarding autopilots, we spoke with Max U. at great length regarding the autopilot program. He says Skymasters aren't at the top of the list but they are maybe 15-20% down. They have started a Turbo Commanche program with the GFC 500 autopilot already, which opens the door. He asked our opinion 500 vs 600 and when we responded the 500 is much more likely to be accepted he agreed but said that the aircraft weight may be an issue. The heaviest aircraft they have certified is the P210 at 4100lbs. At up to 4600 lbs the 337 may be at the top end of their servo capability.

We were EXTREMELY impressed with how honest and open these guys were with us during the discussion. Their parting point was that, unlike STEC, Garmin's management works on the squeaky wheel principle: if we keep asking we are more likely to get it. One thing to consider is to have your dealer or you contact their aviation product support and ask if these things are possible...eventually they end up on the right guy's desk.

Learjetter · #2 07-30-21, 12:38 PM

Thank you for posting that. That news was so good to hear. Called Garmin HQ this AM and can confirm: GI-275 with GEA24 as EIS is A-OK for Skymasters. The "centerline thrust" restriction is removed from the GI-275 installation manual. Confirmed CiES fuel senders STC compatible/required for Cessna 337 with existing pennycap system. Confirmed Garmin dealer installation is NOT required with this mod.

I was literally hours away from ordering JPI EDM-960 since Electronics International has yet to get EI CGR-30P approval for Skymasters (all detailed in other threads). I'm going to plan a local avionics shop assisted install of GI-275 as EIS and CiES senders. I'll try to post pics & details in a new thread when we're done.

chrisb · #3 07-30-21, 01:01 PM

This is good news,
I think we need to figure out 'who's desk this needs to be on' and then start lobbying :-D

The 337 airframe is genuinely outstanding and entirely unique in terms of it's capabilities. It's let down by the lack of avionics support and an integrated, modern flight deck (Digital Autopilot, Modern Navcom and TXI PFD's along with all the other expansion options REALLY changes the game for these aircraft.

The GFC600 autopilot is an absolute dream to fly with. Especially when coupled with something like a GTN750 TXI and G500/G600. I've had experience with the GFC700 in combo with the G1000 on the DA42 and it's just awesome.

hayesjaj · #4 07-30-21, 01:08 PM

Glad we were able to help!

I also forgot one other very interesting detail during the discussions of the 275 displays.

I asked why the 400 IFCS and the 400B were supported autopilots but the 400A was not on the list (aspen specifically allows for it). Their response was they were under the impression that the 400A was a rate based ap and not attitude based. I let them know that is not the case and in fact the computer for the 400A is nearly identical to the 400IFCS unit. They asked me to send supporting details but net net we may get ap support expanded to 400A systems as well.