bi-polar, or am i nuts

[rick bell]

maybe some can explain why the value of aircraft and the value of parts are at odds?

most models are base on supply and demand (excluding monopolies). there is very little
demand for aircraft at this time so values are in the toilet. this should also be reflected
in aircraft parts. several years ago i could purchase a battery box for 100.00 (reasonable)
now i'm quoted 200.00 just only for the top. looks like the salvage yard are going to keep
their inventories and networking will rule though it will slow restoration down to a crawl . please do not get wrong i believe everyone need to make a profit; however it seems that
i'm dealing with Delta trying to check in baggage.

rick

[SkyMac]

Hi Rick

There are many dealers out there when it comes to the supply of serviceable components for our skymasters. Then the price charged for parts in most cases is far beyond resonable comprehension and it varies dramaticaly as I am finding out.

Replacing components that were damaged during dissasembly and at the hands of others is unexpected, dissapointing and not budgeted for, additionally it is not difficult to find replacement items. However when you do find them, getting them at a sensible cost is another challenge alltogether.

Recently I have a need to replace both front and rear spinners due to other third party damage, prices vary up to $1475 USD each for S/H. Now I can obtain spinners for other light twins (even poilished) from $300 to $450. So why should Skymaster spinners be so exspensive S/H when others are not?

So I am still looking for spinners (I have located a front at $320, but it is on hold for another buyer).

Another instance is S/H rudders currently up to $1400+ USD, atleast I have seen a pair recently with tips for $350 USD each advertised undamaged, that's a common sense approach. I bought new unit a while ago now for $800 USD, but would have happily paid $350 for S/H.

When originally looking at a S/H rudder Nov last year, those advertised then are still advertised now, so the stock hasn't moved.

Our skymasters are a great plane and I look forward to the time when mine returns to the air, it will just take longer now for the rebuild as I believe in a fair price for S/H parts.

I'm sure Rick that both your's and my comments will bring varied responses, if common sense doesn't prevail soon, salvage yards will be full of skymaster parts and whole planes as many won't be flying. I agree with your comments around networking, it may take longer but the deals can be beneficial to both parties and not one sided.

Dave

(PS; keep in mind a part or a plane is only worth what someone is prepared to pay for it)

[jchronic]

Look at it this way, Rick: It's simply supply and demand, and the parts suppliers have us 'demanders' (who want to keep our airplanes operating) over a barrel. Our choices, such as they are, are (1) Ground our airplane or fly it with 'deferred items,' (2) Try to sell our airplanes and then spend really big $$ for a replacement (of which there are few for a Skymaster), or simply quit flying, (3) Find - and pay for - the parts we need to keep going.

Sad to say, but like other dwindling fleets in the past, as some owners opt for #2, their airplanes will become parts bins for the rest of us - can you say 'cannibalization?'

As for values, parts or airplanes, like the man from down under said, it's only worth what someone is willing to pay.

Joe

[Ernie Martin]

Allow me to suggest a gentler, kinder reason: with the decline in GA flying, the parts suppliers are also hurting, with the number of sales way down, so they NEED to maintain their pricing to avoid going under. If they were to adjust the price of parts down -- on top of the reduced number of sales -- they would not be here when we next need them.

Ernie

[rick bell]

boy, that is genesis economics - ah let see, my sales are going in the tube so i'll doubble my
prices to generate more revenue. every look at the FBO auctions? there inventories are immense
and they have gone broke and now the parts are sold at 10% of their reasonable value and
at 1% of the value before they went broke - this is not supply and demand, it's supply with
NO demand.

here is a nice antidote: lived in Belize and at the veggie market a vendor brings in a beautify
cabbage; but he wants five times the going rate. as you can imagine it does not sell right away.
as the cabbage starts to wilt the vendor starts removing the bad leaves and so on and so on
till finally the cabbage becomes the worlds smallest cabbage, but never reduces the price of the cabbage (still five time the market rate).

tell me if i'm wrong; but i do not see any difference. several years back a batter box was $100
and it's $ 200 just for the lid.

i appreciate source suppliers, however at a purchase i should be able to sit down without
feeling pain.

[Ernie Martin]

I didn't suggest, Rick, that they double their prices, only that they can't reduce them and also stay in business. If you've talked to Don Neiser recently -- as I have -- you would know where I'm coming from. They are struggling. Yes, once a supplier goes under his inventory sells for peanuts. But while he struggles to stay in business, he can't afford to sell at a lower price.

Ernie

[jchronic]

And to Ernie's earlier point, my use of the phrase "over a barrel" was a poor choice of words. I don't think that most suppliers are necessarily gouging us (pilots); the situation is simply a reflection of the economic realities of the market as it is.

Maintaining an inventory of scarce items for what is essentially a niche - and diminishing - market, i.e. Skymaster owners, isn't a robust business model or a formula for getting rich. With many/most parts either out of production or otherwise hard to find, as long as we want or need to keep our airplanes flying paying the price of admission is going to be a fact of life. And the suppliers are in business to try and make a profit, not to subsidize our avocation.

Joe

[SkyMac]

I strongly recommend the use of Ernies list of suppliers as a key starting point for parts, this along with other information that Ernie has taken the time to compile provides us all with relevant information, enabling choice.

Don should always be the first supplier you contact. He has been a source for a number of parts for my project.

Dave

[Ernie Martin]

I just updated the list last month (it's in the Purchasing Parts page of my "backup" Skymaster website at www.SkymasterUS.com).

Incidentally, at the bottom of the page is an annotated picture of the attendees of the 2004 Skymaster Fly-in, so you can put faces with names for some of the people who participate on this Message Board (e.g., Don Nieser).

Ernie

[Skymaster337B]

I'm blaming Obama for the higher cost of parts, avgas, and lower hull values....oh, but everyone will get free healthcare.