337 or 337p

gregplatt · #1 06-27-17, 04:12 PM

Hi all, i've been lerking around the site for a few years and i've read as much as possible with searching the site but I wanted to get some owners opinions in the current market.
A little about me, i'm a newer pilot, i currently own a piper archer II that i purchased to learn in and build a little time, great plane by the way. I'm quite large t 6'8" and 275#, weight comes with the height. I fly solo a lot, but have a wife who is only 125# and a 2 year old. So i don't need a lot of useful load but sometimes would take in laws so 5 seats is nice. I will fly for work a little, lots of 100nm flights but quite a few 400 to 600nm flights. Would also like to fly to Baja, islands, etc... I'm in the pacific nw so lots of high terrain and unfriendly landing options. I had looked into the cirrus planes but really i think that i want a twin. I like the 337 because it seems docile, i like that!
Anyway to my question, i really want to end up in a P337. That being said should i start out with a basic N/A 337 to begin with then move up. I like the idea of moving up slowly, since a majority of my time so far is in one of the most forgiving airplanes ever made. Some issues i see though is purchasing a pretty cheap N/A 337 then you know i'll want to do a few upgrades, and from what I've seen over the last few years it might take a long time to sell it when I want to move up. Buy the P337 first off and then not feel bad about my upgrade money that will never come back and not have to worry about selling it.
There are some pretty amazing deals on p337's right now, i feel bad for the current owners honestly. Amazing plane for the money. Just in case people ask as to why i want to end up in the p337. I'd love to fly mid teens out of traffic and most weather without oxygen. The p337 appears to actually be more efficient then the N/A planes at some altitude. I think that from what I've read the pressurization is a safety factor for comfort. A typical flight for me is over the cascade range, well i say that but right now i won't fly that in the archer i fly down the gorge then head south because i'm not comfortable SEL over that terrain.

And by the way, this is a p337 that has really caught my attention. https://www.controller.com/listings/...73-cessna-p337

fsnewton · #2 06-27-17, 06:56 PM

Hi Greg,

I was in the same boat as you last summer, but in September I became the proud owner of N84E. Funny thing about being on this site is actually seeing comments from her past owners!
My experience so far has been a great one. I think I got an airplane that fit my mission and was in my price range. I'm 6'2" and 215 with a wife and two growing kids...for the T337G that gets me full fuel, the whole family and plenty of luggage. I'm also in the PNW (Harvey Field-Snohomish) so I love having the second engine. If I had to do it all over again, I would buy either a P337 or T337 for our area...I lean towards the P337 because my wife and kids love the smooth air at altitude, like the speed and hate the cannulas.
As for the price..be careful not to fall in love with the buy-in and get surprised by the maintenance costs. My first annual came in at a "low" $15k...lots of catch up maintenance. I expect (hope) next year will be less, but if not...it looks like I'll be putting off ADS-B for at least another year

. This was a far cry from what I was use to when I owned a Skylane....
That brings me to 337JJ. 337JJ was on my short list when I was in the market and I put an offer on it. Needless to say, we couldn't make it work. the pros: I don't think there is another P337 on the market with the number of toys that 337JJ has. You could probably sell all the avionics on Ebay and break even at the listed price...but I recommend looking at the logbooks closely. There is major damage history in the books and the plane hasn't been flown regularly for the last few years. I would definitely conduct a pre-buy (just like any AC purchase) on that Skymaster.
In short, I'm kicking myself for not buying a P337 earlier. It's really fun to fly and with some good ME training, and understanding of the airframe, I just can't see another platform competing dollar for dollar.

Happy Shopping!
Scott

JamesC · #3 06-28-17, 12:13 PM

Hi Greg. The P337 pressurization is very easy to operate, but these birds get leaky with time, especially if they have had some damage like this one. I would take it for a test flight and among other things see what the pressurization diff is at altitude. The bird doesn't have to be perfect but you would still like to have no wing drop in the power off stall (take your instructor) and see if she flies straight and level hands off. Turbo management is obviously critical and takes more planning ahead. Also you have to see how much your insurance is going to be and even if you can get it depending on eg. how many hours retractable time etc. you have. One more thing – this model is actually a T337G (ie not a P337 even though its serial number begins with P) so the Flint tip wing spar AD could be an issue. There are some great bargains out there but be careful. My first Skymaster seemed like an awesome deal but had plenty of costly hidden nightmares. My mechanic did an import last year for a new Skymaster owner and things were so bad he would not could not see ever signing it off as airworthy. The owner had to get a special flight permit and took it to another shop for lengthy repairs – I don’t think it is flying yet.
Take your time!
Jim

fsnewton · #4 06-28-17, 12:32 PM

Jim,

As a point of comparison, what were the maintenance gotchas you had with your first Skymaster? For me, I right off the bat had a bad fuel sender, some prop governor work and getting the cabin psi to 3.35 (work in progress). But since the annual in December, all systems have been working great and the engines (about 700 SMOH) have been flawless (knock on wood).

Scott

JamesC · #5 06-28-17, 01:57 PM

Same as you plus DG issues (installed an Aspen PFD), hidden hydraulic system corrosion, needed pressure controller overhaul, had turbo failure in flight, diode board issues, belly drain issues and water getting in the belly. Plus a bunch of other stuff, all fixed for $$$ - my wife was really impressed.

Jerry De Santis · #6 06-30-17, 08:29 PM

Hi, I own N34EC, a 1975 P337G unit. This is my second Skymaster having owned a 1971F unit earlier. I purchased N34EC in 1997....20 years now. My yearly annual runs between $2300 and $3500 depending on extra things I want done. If you plan to fly high, I highly recommend the P unit. The 1975 model has a 150 gallon total fuel capacity (148 gallon useful). Three tanks in each wing and unless you want to cross feed, you don't have to switch tanks. My plane is equipped with spoilers so I don't worry about shock cooling engines to make quick alt. Changes. In fact, i don't even change throttle or MP when using spoilers. I also have A/C and highly recommended for the P model. Can get warm in cabin. One factor you should be aware of, I generally burn 25 to 27 gallons per hour with the rear engine using about 1 o 1.5 gallons more per hour. I am a believer of operating rich of peak so engines stay cool. About cylinder head temperatures in the range of 340 to 375 degrees. Exhaust temp. In range of 1100 to 1350 with the higher temps in the rear engine. N34EC is equipped with TSIO 360 CB engines. Have any other questions on the P unit feel free to send me an e-mail.

Good luck on your choice!

Cheers
Jerry

LostKiwi · #7 07-04-17, 10:51 PM

I agonized over the same thing. Once I'd decided I needed a Skymaster, I really did go back and forth over buying a P model, and ended up buying a Normally aspirated 337G.

My reasoning was much the same as yours, I live in the rockies, and for me to go anywhere requires some serious altitude. Having the second stove when flying over tiger country gives me a warm fuzzy feeling.

Happy to report that the NA Skymaster has no real problems with that mission. Climbs like a missile if you want it to, and it'll hold a 500 ft/min cruise climb all the way up to 12,000 ft. Goes in and out of short strips, big, roomy, comfortable cabin for us "husky" gentlemen, and it has more useful load than you can shake a stick at. Absolutely the right airplane for the job.

It does hurt seeing the P model boys up at 17 or 18k with 250 knt ground speeds though - I want a piece of that! Maybe my next airplane......

Leighton.

Jerry De Santis · #8 07-05-17, 10:30 AM

Something to keep in mind when over the mountains, by book values, the P unit will hold 18,500 feet alt on either engine should you experience an engine out. The NA unit will hold about 5,500 feet on the front engine and 7,500 feet on rear engine. Those values were taken from the 1971 F unit. This is why I chose the P unit years ago.