Looking for insurance

[Francisco]

Any good insurance co out there. I Gess Scott Smith has the best when it comes to 336/337?

Thanks

[Bob Cook]

Francisco

You need to define "good".... gotcha!

Bob

[WebMaster]

They are all thieves, Francisco, but Skysmith does a good job of representing 337 owners to the actual insurance companies. Remember, in most cases, you are dealing with an agent, not the actual company. Scott (skysmith) has done a good job of shopping the insurance companies for me, getting the best rate. I compared another company with Scott, last time, and they were substantially higher.

[kevin]

Larry's got it right. There are less than 10 piston aircraft insurance companies. Avemco writes the insurance directly, all the others use agencies. If you use any agent, they will be getting quotes from all the available insurance companies except Avemco. All the agents would like you to think that they have some "connection" that will get you the lowest rate. Scott (Skysmith) used to have that, sortof, in that he operated a Skymaster group insurance program, but the insurance companies are not interested in those any longer, and Scott no longer has this edge.

On the other hand, a long term relationship between the agent and the underwriters *does* help in marginal situations. Aviation insurance is done quite a bit by arbitrary decisions made by the underwriters. If they get along well with the agent, and if they did not have a fight with their wife that morning or a big loss that week, you can get a slightly better rate, or maybe get a yes answer on a marginal insurance situation (low time in type for example) that you might not get otherwise.

I suggest that you contact Avemco and get a quote from them (make sure you are sitting down first, they have been thousands of dollars higher that other companies in the past, for my needs anyway). Then select a single agent based on his or her reputation, and how easy it is for you to work with that agent. They will get the quotes for you from all the other companies, and then you can make a decision.

Once in a while, you hear about somebody changing agents and getting a better quote from the new agent. Nearly always that happens because of a lack of communication (by unintentional or "intentional" mistake) about your situation. For example, if you get a quote from one agent that is high, then you change agents, and neglect to mention to the second agent that you had a gear up accident and drunk driving conviction last year, you will definitely get a better rate from the second agent. Less dramatically, if "by mistake) an agent tells an insurance company that you have a private license with 500 hours, and you only have 300, they will get you a better quote. BUT...

Insurance obtained with inaccurate information is worse than no insurance at all. The insurance companies nearly always find out the truth when and if a claim is filed, and if the mistake is large enough, it can invalidate your claim, and you get paid nothing. So you paid nice low premiums (and the agent got the commission) for insurance that is worth nothing...

If you want to have insurance, tell your agent the truth about your situation, and pick a well known agent with a good rep. Take the best quote you can get for the coverage you want, and be done with it. If you don't want to do it that way, don't buy insurance at all, you are wasting your money.

I have used Scott Smith as my agent for the last seven years, have been very happy with him, and recommend him. Before that, I used several other agents, because I didn't really understand the above information.

My two cents.

Disclaimer: The above information comes from several sources. I have been involved in a service venture that would address the aircraft insurance agents as a market, so I have spent a non-trivial amount of time chatting with insurance agents and underwriters from many of the companies involved. Also, Scott Smith has become a personal friend of mine. I believe I would recommend him even if he were not, but the friendship exists.

Kevin

[Kevin McDole]

There's aspect of shopping for insurance that is kind of odd ...

If you get a quote through one agent - the insurance companies will not quote coverage for that N number again. This effectively locks you in to the first agent that you ask for a quote. It's kind of hard to believe this is legal - but it is how the system works.

In light of that, I do not understand how others "price shop" - it seems impossible, unless you are somehow not using the same N number for the various quotes. An agent won't even talk to you if you tell them you got a quote from another agent. Avemco seems like the only possibility for a price shopping comparison.

Incidentally, I use AOPA - and the underwriter is North American Specialty Insurance. One of the big variables in cost is whether they require recurrency training (which is not a bad idea). That can quickly add $3,000 (travel, lodging & tuition) to your actual out of pocket expenses.

[kevin]

I believe that the insurance companies do it to reduce their workload. In theory, if you submit all the correct information, their quote through each agent would be exactly the same. So if you "price shop" by contacting six agents, they end up with the same quote out six times. There is paperwork required for each quote, they have to track it, etc.

If you have have trouble with a particular agent, and want to get the same quote you already got but buy through another agent, you can ask the new agent you select to submit an agent change letter (I think, I am not really an expert on this stuff), and if you have any justification at all, I believe the company will sell to you through your requested agent.

The only place this system can break down is if your agent does not ask for quotes from all eight companies. And frankly, in real life, that is what happens, because an experienced agent will know that company X will not write Skymasters, or will not write them economically. But what I am talking about is the situation where an agent finds the highest quote, and tells you only about that one, to increase their commissions. In other words, a crook.

Again, in real life, I don't think this happens much, because you will talk to your friends, find out you are paying a high rate, and use your friend's agent the next year. So agents that did this would be out of biz quickly.

It does seems to be a strange system compared to other types of business that we all do...

Kevin

[Francisco]

Thanks For the info .... Will Advice

Francisco