engines

sunnysky · #1 02-21-04, 09:26 AM

I live in France and are just about to order two Factory IO360G thru Airpower, in the USA. Anyone out there had dealings with them ? They seem a good price but live so far away if anything goes wrong !

Guy Paris · #2 02-21-04, 12:20 PM

Hi Sunnysky,

I have dealt with Air Power and always had excellent results.
Bought a factory reman thru them and received great service. However after (7) yes (7) hours the engine went sour… I (we)then had to deal with Continental which in my opinion was not pleasant.. They wanted to repair the engine at there repair facility in New York. Not that I didn’t have the highest respect for that facility however I just felt it was unfair to have a factory engine with (7) hours and have a repair history.. We prevailed however it took much time and energy. It took (2) yes (2) more trips for that engine back to the factory.. before it had a clean log book. True they were dealing with their crank shaft fiasco at that time but I felt I was a customer too. Guy, the old 72 driver……………

kevin · #3 02-21-04, 03:48 PM

I bought two reman engines through Airpower a couple of years ago, and was very pleased with the service. I too had a warranty issue with one of the engines, and the folks at Airpower bent over backwards to do everything they could do (unfortunately not much) to help me with Continental.

Continental, on the other hand, was a pain in the butt. I live in Oregon, and the Continental rep (for my area at least) lived in Alaska. Not exactly conveniently located if you ask me. I had trouble reaching him by phone, trouble getting him to deal with my issue when I did finally reach him. In the end, I had to write a letter to the president of Continental, with a copy to the attorney who will handle my estate, getting it on record that if a catastrophic failure occurred with this engine (it had low oil pressure, and the pressure got lower the warmer the engine was) that resulted in injury or death to me and my passengers, that my attorney was instructed to sue for damages. That got me the attention I needed, and Airpower managed getting the replacement engine to me and getting the warranty credit for labor on the R&R.

I would definitely used Airpower again, I was very satisfied with them. Great price too, compared to other alternatives!

Kevin

Richard · #4 02-21-04, 07:46 PM

I bought two through them. Same story, had one fail 106 hours later. Dealing with air power was great until they handed me off to the Continental Rep living on the other side of the planet. Even he was nice, just didn't do much for me. Ended up costing me 8k anyways.

Mitch Taylor · #5 02-21-04, 09:04 PM

This discussion makes me a little nervous! Judging by these responses, a factory reman has a 50% chance of going south at a very low time. Makes me wonder about their quality control.

Guy Paris · #6 02-21-04, 09:36 PM

That was an interesting approach to the problem Kevin!
Had I read a response like that I would have used a
different approach with Continental. What happened to
my fan was at close to the (7) hour mark we decided to
lean the engine more than we had been. There I was out
and about (at night) when I could not figure out what was
going on, it looked like a fuel metering issue and loosing
power. Investigation the following day found the problem,
the damm thing was trying to go into feather and on the
ground almost did. I made the first call to Continental and
then the trouble began. The conversation ended with
something like, “well if there is nothing wrong with that
engine YOU are going to pay”. With that I let the mechs
deal with them for most of it. It turned out that the thrust
bearing was out of tolerance and would loose pressure to
the prop and I think the case had to be split. I then had to
get on Continental’s case to pay them for the R/R’s. Sure
wish at that time I had another option for an engine.
Guy, the old 72 driver….

sunnysky · #7 02-22-04, 02:30 AM

Hmmmnnn. makes me nervous too, when Continental factory engines are making 7 hours.
My present engines run great, with good oil pressure and cool temperatures after almost 1700 hours when we became aware the airmelt/var crankshaft issue. Thats the only reason for new engines as on the U.K. register we can run on condition on a private CofA. unless there are such AD's.
One final thought. My engines are on their first run. There must be many engines in service with airmelt cranks with thousands of total hours on the cranks which were "overhauled" before the AD and with less than 1500 hrs now ? Any ideas why this AD was issued? I have never heard of many crank failures on these sturdy engines.

Jerry De Santis · #8 02-22-04, 07:27 AM

I was thinking about new engines but after reading the previous comments, I'll have my current engines rebuilt. From the comments, it seems Cont. has a major quality problem. I wonder if they ever read the comments on this site?
Jerry
N34ec

Ernie Martin · #9 02-22-04, 01:12 PM

Sunnysky, there is a group of people (including GMAS, a Skymaster expert who used to contribute to this Message Board) who believe that the AD should not have been issued, that the failure rate of airmelt and VAR cranks was not significantly different, and that the FAA bowed to pressure from Continental. The failure data I have seen seems to support this point, but one never knows if one is seeing the whole picture, so I don't have a position on this.

Ernie

Guy Paris · #10 02-22-04, 03:52 PM

Look at the troubles they, Continental had with the recent cranks, some type of metalurgical problem. guy, the old 72 driver...

However Lycoming did too recently.. Gotta reinvent the wheel... sometimes better sometime.. well......

Dave Underwood · #11 02-23-04, 06:30 AM

A thought for you to consider is that CSE in Oxford will sell you a new crank for £1800 exchange. I think that is what they quoted me but for my turbo engines, might be less for non-turbo. If the engines are first runs, then the O/H option might be a good one for you, certainly less expensive.

As I am running an N reg here in the UK and had second run O/H'd engine on the rear with poor paperwork, I took the CSE factory reman route specifically for the local warranty support and new paperwork. CSE has a pretty good reputation.

If you are around Coventry, I am parked at Air Parks - drop past.

Regards - Dave

Frank Benvin · #12 02-23-04, 11:27 AM

What about the Royal-Royce Engines??? I know there is a guy in Washington state with them in his 1973 P337. Any one have experiance or knowlege on putting these engines in a skymaster???

Mark Hislop · #13 02-23-04, 12:49 PM

Frank:

I have a RR engine in my aircraft (front). It was put in before I got it, but it was entered in the logbook just as if a new TCM engine was put in. It was a factroy new engine that had been in storage. It has been a very good engine (about 900 hours now, and all compressions in the mid to high 70's).

However, as far as I know, the RR engines are still the light case, and they have the non VAR crank. If you rebuild one, you will still have to put in the new VAR crank.

Mark

sunnysky · #14 02-24-04, 02:05 AM

Yes . My present engines are Rolls Royce manufacture. They wre licence built in the UK during the 70s. They are identical to the Continental and as Mark says, they have light cases and the non var cranks which were not available at that time. Anyone know what the position is with the light cases ? Are all "factory" engines now supplied with heavier cases ?
Thanks for all the replies guys. Also to the one from the UK. I will call CSE to see their costs etc.
sunnysky.

Mark Hislop · #15 02-24-04, 09:34 AM

This is my understanding of the "light" case vs. the "heavy" case. The original engines specified for the 337 were the TSIO-360C6B. This engine has the "light" case. The engine recommended now, and permitted in the TCDS, is the TSIO-360CB6B. The "CB" engine has the "heavy" case, as well as some other internal modifications. I think the "C" engine is still available, and is about $1,000 less expensive than the "CB".

Mark